In this episode of the Samson Strength Coach Collective, we sit down with Jess Givens, Assistant Strength and Conditioning Coach at the University of North Dakota. Jess walks us through her early days as an apprentice at a D3 school, the leap to D1, and the valuable lessons she learned about building relationships with athletes, maintaining professionalism, and seeking mentorship. Most powerfully, she shares her honest experience with burnout and why getting support through therapy changed her life and coaching approach. From open-minded programming to meal prepping as self-care, Jess’s story is one of resilience and intentionality.
Key Takeaways
- Jess began her career at the University of Wisconsin Eau Claire as an apprentice.
- Transitioning to D1 helped her broaden her coaching perspective.
- D1 and D3 athletes often have very different mentalities and cultures.
- Personal connections and communication are key to athlete development.
- Coaches must balance professionalism with personalism to build trust.
- Burnout is real—seeking therapy was a pivotal moment in Jess’s career.
- Mentorship shaped her growth as a coach.
- Staying open-minded in training methods creates stronger athlete engagement.
- Meal prepping is part of Jess’s personal strategy for maintaining wellness.
Quote:
“One day I’m like, I need to go talk to somebody… it was nice just to have someone there I can talk to and not be judgmental at all.”
— Jess Givens
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Jess Givens:
about a year and a couple months in, and it was when I was realizing like, you
Working a part-time job to help pay for things. I’m not getting paid the most for it for five teams. Working day in and day out. I am doing extra work on the side, not just at the university, but I was a waitress at a time just to get some more money in. So that worry just kind of got all bundled up. And one day I’m like, I need to go talk to somebody. And I ended up going talking to a therapist about once a week to help let all out. But it was also nice just to have someone there I can talk to and not be judgmental at all or.
They’re just there as a big support system. wasn’t someone who never knew anything about me, about my life, just someone who would sit there and listen.
Connor Agnew:
What’s going on Sampson Strength Coach Collective listeners on today’s episode, we have Jess Givens, Assistant Training Conditioning Coach for University of North Dakota. Jess, thank you so much for coming on.
Jess Givens:
Thank you for having me.
Connor Agnew:
I’m super excited to speak with you. I’m jealous. I love schools that have their primary color is green. It’s like one of my favorite colors for gear. I’m a Jets fan, so I got to get some gear when I went up there for their internship, but I’m very jealous of the North Dakota green. You’re rocking.
Jess Givens:
It was a different color. I’ve always been around red, blues, and darker colors, but green, it’s finally got some color in my closet. I’m pretty happy about it. ⁓ absolutely.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah, you got to stick with it now. There’s no choice now. Awesome.
Well, can you just give us a breakdown of your full career, everything that led you to training conditioning and then what’s led you to your current position?
Jess Givens:
Absolutely. I actually started my, I say, overall career when I was an apprentice at the University of Wisconsin Eau Claire. My senior year there, I was an apprentice underneath the head strength and sports performance coach, Zach Rock. So it was kind of a great way to be taking classes, but also we’re starting to get a little more involved with the strength conditioning realm. After that, I did an internship over the summer when I graduated with an exercise science degree. There in the private sector was a little different. So I had the D3 experience and then move into the private sector.
So over the summer I was there, got my degree. I then went for my master’s in strength and conditioning at the University of River Falls. Comes to UW schools, big way act. And I was there for an intern for my first semester and then progressing to an actual GA position after I got my CSCS, which was huge. So when I got a GA position there, I was able to have three teams under my jurisdiction. I had hockey, soccer, and women’s lacrosse. Fantastic group of girls. I love them to death. There’s photos of them on my wall, always in my heart.
But after that, I unfortunately had to leave. It was only a year program at River Falls. So after that, I actually took a step back and interned at the University of Wisconsin-Madison. I was at the Cole Center with AJ Whitehead, Jim Snyder, and Paul Velloucas with both the basketballs and hockey programs there. Just wanted to get some D1 experience before I jumped into something too big after I graduate, because you never know in our realm. There’s positions opening and closing. It’s all about time of the year, what’s going on, which shift changes.
So I then eventually got my position opened at St. Mary’s University in Minnesota. That was my first full assistant position open. It’s a private D3 college in Winona, Minnesota, super small school. I was there for about a year and a half. I had five teams underneath my jurisdiction. And then I assisted with hockey camp. We had the summer game management, a bunch of side quests. I really enjoyed just being involved with athletics during that time. So putting all hands on with that. And then
After a year and a half, I realized I needed to kind of move up in the realm. We all know, like, unfortunately, salary’s not the best for us, and working five teams, you know, 80 hour weeks or even 60 hour weeks is sometimes too much. So I eventually found this job at the University of North Dakota. It opened up, and I took the chance and applied, and I was coming home from Florida, seeing some family down there, when I got the call from Derek Stein of like…
Hey, we’d like to offer you this opportunity. And not even a week later, I was moving up to North Dakota, moved into my apartment January 1st of 2025, and I’ve been here since.
Connor Agnew:
That’s awesome. That’s such a cool story. And, um, I love is you’ve just been dominating the Midwest. I’m sure that’s the case. Absolutely. And I’m from, I’m from upstate New York. So, um, I’ve lived in basically the South ever since I started my career and everybody just complains about the snow when it snows like two or three inches. And I’m like, you guys have no clue what it could possibly be like, like you’ve got absolutely no idea. So that’s awesome. Well, okay. One thing that was really interesting that you mentioned was you went from your GA.
Jess Givens:
Yes, it just gets colder and colder wherever I go.
Ooh.
silly.
Connor Agnew:
back to an internship, which can be, obviously in your case, it worked out very well and it was one of the best decisions you could possibly make. What led you to be okay with that decision? Because sometimes people would advise against that. And then what do you feel like you got out of being able to do that?
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, I actually got advised against that from the director of athletic performance at Ripper falls at that time, Carmen Pata. said, are you, are you sure you want to do this? This is really what you want to do. And I realized D3 and D1 are very different on the spectrum when it comes to working with athletes, but also scheduling. So I wanted to get my feet wet in the D1 realm and the best way possible was at UW Madison, I lived 30 minutes away so I could live at home. So I was financially stable in that part, but also drive down, get D1 experience being an intern there.
The bonus part about my internship at TAP at the time, I was able to come back and actually pay me to be a coach there. So I was having a side gig of being a private sector coach, but then also going to D1 experience as an intern. That is about three months of internship at Madison that I learned so much about and realized the workload, the caliber of athletes is completely different compared to D3. And it just kind of put me in perspective of I’m not ready for D1. And that’s what I needed to know.
I need to know right after being a GA, where would I be comfortable and be competent enough in my abilities to coach as, can I go straight to D1? Could I go D2 or D3, stick to the private sector? And I would rather have all that resources and ability to, or experience before I immediately committed to something and be like halfway through, I can’t do this anymore, and then jump out. Because I don’t want to hop from job to job. doesn’t look the best on a resume. So I’d rather sacrifice the time I have.
do an intern for a couple of months and stay at home and save money that way versus relocate across the country for a job or an internship and not like it and have to come all the way back.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah, that makes complete sense and financially smart too, which I love to hear. ⁓
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm. Yeah,
it was a blessing in disguise and the fact that the guys back at TAP, Zach and Zach, they’re both different Zachs, they are the heart and soul to keeping me at home. If it wasn’t for them, I probably would not progress as far as I did. They had my back during my internship. They said, hey, we want you to come back for the summer if you could. We’d love to pay you for that. Bless their hearts. I would not have been able to get as far as I did without them.
Connor Agnew:
That’s awesome. And those people are just so important in your career and they can really just either make it or break it truly. ⁓
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm.
Connor Agnew:
Kind of something that think a lot of coaches neglect is that they don’t realize that they can get people very excited about training conditioning or they can turn them off completely. So I’m glad to hear that you had a positive experience with them. When you look at D3 versus D1, like you mentioned a couple of the differences, you know, just slightly like scheduling and, you know, athlete quality or not quality. Let me say a better word, caliber, like you said. ⁓ Again, I’m messing, I’m terrible with my English, I apologize. But ⁓ what were some of the main differences that you really saw?
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm.
Connor Agnew:
D3 and D1, what were the things that really stuck out to you? ⁓ And do you still see those differences as you progress past your career, past the point where you went to Wisconsin for your internship?
Jess Givens:
would say being from UW-Madison, which is a Big Ten school here at University of North Dakota, yes, they’re both D1, but the type of athlete that’s here, just culture-wise, is a little different. I would say down at Madison, they were very well, they had the talent, that’s the reason why they were down there. But they also, think, just as me personally saying, is that they knew a lot about themselves, they knew where they were gonna go already, they kind of had that expectation of going pro, so they kind of had almost that little
I explain it, try to think of the proper word for it. Not much of an ego, but more of like, hey, I know what I’m capable of. So especially coming from a GA to an intern position and trying to coach them, you didn’t get as valued as much. They kind of want to do what they wanted to do. And when it came to their coach telling them what to do, oh, great and all. But I think it was just kind of more of a respect thing of, hey, they’re here for their sport. They’re going to do what they need to do for it versus here. The culture is based on a team effort. They all know.
here to play their sport. Yes, school is a part of it, but they just really want to get better at that and they’ll do whatever they can. They’re always asking for more help, talking to the resources. And maybe it just the culture of how that was. I think it was a great way for me to experience D1 right away and understand, hey, there’s the pros and there’s the cons. Whereas in D3, I had athletes that are there for the academics. They’re there to graduate, have a career in their future. So.
Their love for their sport was a little more intrinsically driven. They didn’t have that concept of like, I can play pro. I’m going to focus on my sport. It’s, hey, I love what I do. So it’s more passion driven. It’s more, I’m doing it for the love of the game, not just, hey, I want to be able to get my name out there.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah, no, I think that’s such a great point. That’s one of the main things that I’ve heard. Like ⁓ one of my former mentors was the strength coach at Wisconsin Whitewater, right? ⁓ And he said, you know, it was probably the most fun he’s ever had as a strength coach because all these people were there just because they loved playing football, right? And it wasn’t about, OK, I know for a fact that Wisconsin Whitewater is going to get me to the Jets or whatever, right? It’s typically not going to be the case, but they’re there because they love actually playing the sport.
Jess Givens:
Yeah.
Connor Agnew:
And so you see a little bit more of that intrinsic drive, which I feel like has got to be really cool to see.
Jess Givens:
It it loves. And that was one of the biggest things I loved about River Falls is the G.A. Not even a full-time coach. When I worked with the women’s hockey team, they were a team that I eventually got pulled into as like a family. Like my last day with them, I cried. It the first time I ever cried as a coach. And that really showed me like they weren’t just dedicated to their sport. They’re dedicated to their purpose, to their culture. They love saying, hey Jess, you want to come travel with us? So having me be a part of that was also another big thing of, hey, I’m not just a resource. I’m a human being to them.
That entire family with Joe Cranston, Amanda Ryder and Joe Walsh, their coaches, they were just an amazing family. Like that’s D3 for you. And I haven’t had the opportunity to hear too much as D1. You indeed see a lot of that because I got pulled in the middle of everything. But I learned from the football team here, they’ve got that here even at D1. These guys are something Coach Schmidt, when he came in, set the standards, this culture of family always with their breakdown. And the fact that I’m seeing that now from D3 at River Falls, D1 here, it’s like.
I have this I’m supposed to be here feeling like there’s a reason this is all connected.
Connor Agnew:
That’s awesome and it just makes it so much more fun to go into work every single day. So what do you think goes into that, into the family aspect of it? Because I think a lot of coaches really search for that. I think there’s a lot of different reasons I feel it with the team I’m currently with, But what do you think are the main aspects that really go into it?
Jess Givens:
Absolutely.
The biggest thing I think is communication. If they’re all on the same page with communicating, but also they’re there for each other. They all have like their own goals of what they want to do. If we have like the pro camps that they, host, they want to hopefully go pro. But in the meantime, they’re here in the present moment. And a big thing that they have is the best teams are player led, not coach led. And I think that really helps develop that bond between the athletes of holding each other accountable. You know, if someone’s on the ground doing a movement and they walk by, they help pick them up.
They’re always there supporting each other and like just calling each other out for like mistakes and stuff too. Like that’s accountability right there. That’s a family right there knowing you’re not gonna be left behind. No one wants to be last running to get water or go to the next drill. They’re there together and that’s a full family for you.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah, I agree. And I think one big piece too is like the removal of emotions. When you, like you said, with accountability, like my sisters can tell me almost anything that if a stranger told me I get really upset about, right? Versus if it’s coming from them because I know they love me and they truly care about me, that could be a critique of what I’m doing. Like I would really listen to them. And it just, if you can remove those emotions and take that accountability and stride, it makes the world a difference.
Jess Givens:
Mm.
Absolutely. Yeah, even they hold us accountable. If us coaches make a mistake, they got us on it’s like, Hey, Jess, you got three up downs, you made a mistake here. And even we’ll do it. Like that’s just not accountability for the players. It’s the entire team that’s associated with them. It’s fantastic.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah, it’s cool and it makes
it more fun and it makes you involved in the team, right? And it makes you, like you said, more of a family. How has your experience been? You started off, it’s been six months now, North Dakota.
Jess Givens:
Absolutely. yeah.
Yeah, just go into seven here. Lily started like the second week of January. Getting thrown into the middle of things were very chaotic in manner of softball was going to preseason track and field already started their indoor and then football was winter ball. So it was a lot of, Hey, I got to up at 3 a.m. because we got to be at the facility at 430 a.m. So it was kind of crazy. I have a big shift for me, but since being in early mornings, late nights, that’s just our career we’re used to it. But I was grateful that the football team was
the first team I exposure to because they immediately felt, made me feel comfortable. The guys knew I was new, being the shortest female in the entire area. They’re like, hey, I’m Olsen, what’s your name? Or hey, I’m Biles, what’s your name? They immediately were able to make me feel comfortable around 106 guys. was like, all right, start all over again, new place. And honestly, two weeks later, I just started feeling comfortable having conversations, found out two of our guys are from Wisconsin as well, so we were able to talk about the Packers or.
our crappy hockey team choices. It’s just that really helped ease me back into this career, especially in D1 going from St. Mary’s to here. It was a big transition. As soon as I got to meet the softball girls, that’s the team that I’ve always loved being around. I felt comfortable as well knowing, hey, we have softball relation. We can talk about it. I get to know the players a little bit more. The newest team was track and field, all the events going on. So being able to sit down with their coach, Jim and Molly, was in Tom for cross country.
They are very knowledgeable coaches. Jim knows everything about the strength condition side of things. So being able to talk shop with him about what he’s done for his athletes really helped kind of ease me back into it over here. So I’m really grateful for her just you and Deanna like, Hey, she’s new, but let’s help her out. Let’s do what we can to make her feel comfortable because we want her here for a long time.
Connor Agnew:
That’s awesome. That’s such a cool experience. I’m really glad to hear that. I can tell, and it’s unique, seriously. mean, if we’re being honest, every school isn’t necessarily like that. There’s some schools where everybody knows the turnaround is quick ⁓ and people’s careers there are short and it’s kind of some people view it as a stepping stone. So I’m really glad that you’re able to find something where, like you said, people really want to hold you there for a long time. That’s awesome.
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah, I can tell that relationships are really big thing to you. And I can tell that, you know, it’s a key piece of what you really want to do just from your language in this past 15 minutes. You know, what are kind of your key points of relationship development with your athletes?
Jess Givens:
One of the biggest things I’ve learned, especially being a young coach, was the balance between professionalism and personalism. Because one of the biggest things not even a couple months ago, so I’ve been here for a while, was some of athletes were trying to figure out how old I was. And so when they asked me that, I’m like, well, how old do you think I am? And they immediately just jumped to like 21 or 22. So when I go, no, I’m 26, they kind get that shock factor of like, oh, she’s been here for a while. And I appreciate the compliment if I look younger than I am.
Connor Agnew:
Mm.
Jess Givens:
But that’s kind of like building that professional, but also personal boundary of like, hey, I am your coach, but also being able to have those social conversations of asking how they’ve been, how was your weekend, spend time with family and building that relationship right away, especially the professional boundary helps in the long term. I mean, long, long term. So making sure you’re able to not just connect with them in a professional manner, but also personal. One of the biggest things I found was from coach Brett Bartholomew and his conscious coaching book.
was the three Rs. was research, reflame, research, reflect, reframe. So when you get to meet an athlete, you immediately start opening to questions. Ask them how they are, what they like to do, and that kind of starts to build in that conversation. But of course, when it comes to new athletes and you’re being also a new coach, they kind of just don’t want to feel like they’re getting the 20 question game. But that’s when you start to kind of relate to them, talk a little more, what’s going on.
Especially with my softball girls, like, hey, I used to play softball. I was a catcher. So I understand when your hips are really crappy. I understand completely. And then you kind of get to the reframe part of being able to connect a little more of, hey, this is why we’re doing something. And that kind of starts the entire buy-in with athletes. And that kind of really helps, especially when I come as a young coach to like, oh, she’s probably just an intern or a GA. No, I’ve been here for a while, and I want to make sure you all understand that. But we can still talk about how, hey,
How was your weekend last night? Because I can sure as hell guarantee you had fun for fourth of July weekend.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah,
absolutely. We came back from 4th of July and I told our guys I don’t even want to hear about it. So because I knew it was going to be things that wouldn’t make me super stoked. But ⁓ you know, you bring up such a great point, which is the balance between professionalism and ⁓ personalism. I think that’s what the word is correct. So, you know, ultimately, how do you know?
Jess Givens:
You
Connor Agnew:
that you’re kind of mastering that balance. And like you said, it’s a very thin line. What are some indicators that you may be leaning too far off into one side, right? Like where professionalism may be kind of compromised just a little bit. What are some indicators to you and then what are the things that you do to correct it?
Jess Givens:
Absolutely. ⁓ We know as coaches, we all have our own personalized outside of the weight room as well. So making sure, there’s things, there’s times where like you might be out grocery shopping and an athlete sees you. And that’s one thing of like conversation, just like the simple like, hi, how are you? But that’s also where you’re like, hey, you gotta understand that you’re gonna set a good example to them. What’s in my shopping cart? It’s not cheesecake, donuts and pizza. It’s like, I’m also having the good healthy products as well. But when it comes into the weight room, also having that
professionalism and personalism like you said it comes with how you talk I would say because I can have an athlete have a friendly conversation because they might bring up a debate they’re having between teammates and you get asked into that conversation whether it’s like what’s your thoughts about this football team and you can bring your own personal opinions into it like I’m a Packer fan around ⁓ commanders Vikings you name it here and they can have that friendly conversation but the moment things kind of get a little more on your personal side where you have that little too much
That’s when you’re able to like have more of a stern voice or just have like an answer of like, no, or I just don’t feel comfortable talking about that. Or especially if an athlete sees me out or something of like, going grocery shopping and like, hey, what would you have in that grocery bag? I don’t think donuts is a healthy breakfast option. And I’ll look at them and say, one, that’s my breakfast, not yours. You’re the athlete here, not me. But also just letting them know like, hey, I also can see you outside. We all have our own personal lives. I don’t get involved with yours. You don’t get involved with mine.
And I kind of lead into that conversation if it needs to. But whenever it does get little too more personal, I just say, hey, this is my life. I’m not going to get myself involved with yours, so please don’t get involved with mine. And usually they all respect that, because they understand, like, hey, I’m getting too close to coach, or hey, this is part of her life. And a lot of athletes I’ve been around, they respect that. They absolutely do. If they continue to do that, that’s when I have a conversation with Coach Stein about it. Like, hey, I feel little uncomfortable about this. Can we have a discussion? Or with Coach Schmidty with his athletes.
especially if they start to get a little too relaxed around me, that’s when it’s like, hey, I am your coach first, than anything. I’m not your homie or homeboy. I am your coach here. So you need to respect me as one. And if you’re not going to, we’ll have a conversation about
Connor Agnew:
Yeah. No, you bring up such great points. And I really appreciate that. Like the first one, obviously about the grocery cart example, you, you cracked me up because I’m literally thinking of an example from when I was a GA, ⁓ I had like a 24 pack of cores and like two tombstone pizzas in my cart. And I ran into somebody I was like, Hey, you know, and then now that I’m married to a dietitian, like what eight to 10 years later, like it’s all Kiwis and know, Chobani’s and stuff like that. So now I don’t get worried, but I used to certainly be worried about running an athlete’s at the grocery store. ⁓
You know one question for you, and I’m just curious like because I just truly don’t know the experience I’ve worked in football before but do you feel like as a female sometimes people can push those Professional boundaries a little bit more or is that not something you’ve experienced?
Jess Givens:
It is something I have experienced. Not even just as a full-time coach with football, but I do have experience working with men’s hockey. So men’s hockey, men’s basketball, all around sports with the men’s side. There is a little difference and I understand that as men naturally they’re going to get used to, they’re used to the strength coach of the big upper-bine, the bald linemen. So it’s kind of hard getting that buy-in. It’s not more of them having more of personal boundary. It’s more of a respect grown. Because as soon as they find out like, I know my stuff, I know what I’m talking about.
it kind of grows even to a stronger bond. Because even over time in my prep sector, have athletes still reaching back to me today of like, hey coach, I know we haven’t spoken like years, but I have this thing coming up, what would you suggest? And those are the relationships of like, holy cow, I’m so glad you reached out to me of all coaches. And I believe yes, sometimes it does get a little, I’d say weird, but there is that of, I’m curious.
Like I can sense it almost, but that’s right away. The professional line kind of pops in right away and I keep it like that the entire time and they kind of get the hint over time. So yes, it does come in every so often. And that’s kind of where I think being around men hockey players, I learned to chirp as you say enough where I can talk their language, but then if they try to cross that boundary, I’ll use that language against them of like, I’m your coach and you’re not going to do this to me. Understand that. And they respect it completely. I love it. So.
Connor Agnew:
That’s awesome.
Jess Givens:
I think that’s also another buying of like, hey, I understand, but not happening.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah, just immediately shutting down. I love that. That’s fantastic.
And no, I appreciate it. Your insight into that. Because again, like I said, I just don’t have experience with that. So it’s always interesting for me to hear from other coaches about what those experiences are like. know, another big piece that I can tell too is that you’ve mentioned a lot of different names in your career and a lot of different people who have influenced you. Anytime I speak with the coach and especially after doing this podcast for a long time, like I can tell when
somebody has strong mentors, right? And people who have really kind of instilled ⁓ solid lessons into them. typically, you know, the main sign is that they bring the names up every time they speak to somebody. Because I end up doing the same thing because I had some amazing mentors, you know, what are some of the main lessons that you’ve learned from your mentors in your career?
Jess Givens:
Well, the first one, like we mentioned, is the professionalism and the personalism. I first learned that one as a GA because I was, at the same time, a graduate student, but also an assistant coach. So Carmen Pada was my coach, or my overseer at the time, and he’s one of my biggest mentors. He was the director of athletic performance at River Falls, but he was one of the biggest influences when it came to that because he taught me what the difference is between being a GA and a full-time assistant coach. Working with athletes my same age, that was able to
do the buy-in, understand what the class is, the age gap and all that, very similar. But being able to immediately have that professionalism of like, hey, in the weight room, I’m your coach. Outside, I understand we’re the same age, we’re classmates, but they still have that basic starting block of she’s my coach professionalism. So starting that right away was very strong building relationships. Like even to this day, a lot of the athletes I worked with as a GA are, I wouldn’t say like athletes of mine, but.
almost friends to that point because we still have that professionalism of like, they can reach out to me as a coach or if they just need, you know, female perspective or asking human questions, I’m here for them. So that was a big one right away. Another one when it came to my first step into this realm was with Zach Ruck. It was being open-minded because in our realm, it’s constantly changing. There’s new ideas, there’s new concepts and doesn’t help with TikTok and social media, throwing out crazy things in the weight room.
It’s like, all right, let’s watch this. We can’t judge it right away. But then afterwards, they’re like, all right, pros and cons are complete con. And having the open mind shows the athletes so that you’re also willing to listen and learn from them because sometimes they might know things more than we do. At River Falls, that was kind of like my first full-time exposure to hockey. So when I was being more open-minded, I strapped on skates one day and decided to go out on the ice. And my girls lit up when they saw me out there skating thinking, oh my gosh, Coach Jess, she skates.
So they gave me crap about that until I went out on the ice with them one day after practice and they ate that up. They loved the fact I was putting my shoes or my feet literally in their shoes. So be an open mind of how they feel like, it was a lot harder than I thought. And that’s just another reason for buying as well. Like you showing them that you care enough to put yourself at that disadvantage to embarrass yourself on the ice. Go for it. Absolutely go for it.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah, in those moments, like you said, that’s like the part of the family aspect thing, right? Where you can ⁓ be okay with embarrassing yourself a little bit too. And I feel like strength coaches can kind of shy away from that, ⁓ just because again, like you said, there’s a stereotypical tough, like authoritarian kind of guy.
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm.
Connor Agnew:
⁓ But that’s, it’s funny because I feel like I almost have an advantage because I’m a bigger guy and I’ve got a beard and I always kind of, I’ve got like resting, you know, whatever face. ⁓ And so everybody always kind of thinks I’m a jerk, but then I get to make fun of myself a little bit. And then I feel like it opens a lot more doors into building relationships with the athletes. ⁓ Did you, okay, did you know how to skate when you first went on the ice?
Jess Givens:
You ⁓
I knew how to go forward and around the rink. That was about it. I got my skates at Eau Claire, but I never actually got really into skating until I started working with the hockey team and I started going to other practices and I’m like, all right, I need to understand what’s going on here. And once I did, actually one of the players came out onto the ice every so often and helped me skate. So I can now like actually skate, do some crossovers, go backwards. I have sticks and gloves and helmet.
Connor Agnew:
Okay.
that’s awesome.
Jess Givens:
So that was a great way for me to also help with hockey cams when I get my first time job at St. Mary’s because we hosted a lot of youth hockey cams. So me being able to understand what they’re going to do when they grow up and how their body needs to move. mind you, like I said, I was a catcher in softball high school days, so I have crappy hips. I can relate to goalies so well with mobility now. It’s fantastic. ⁓
Connor Agnew:
Yeah, that’s huge.
It’s funny because I obviously, like said, I grew up in upstate New York and one of the big things in the winter was everybody would go to the local skating rink. Like that’s where you’d skate and that’s where you’d hang out, you know, and you’d like hang out with all your friends and everything. And so I’ve always known how to ice skate. And then I remember we did it in Knoxville one day. They had like an open skate or something and nobody could do it. And I felt like the king of the world. So I love being able to flex that. Yeah. Yeah.
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm.
That’s awesome.
Connor Agnew:
But again, I really appreciate your perspective on that and being okay with embarrassing yourself just slightly or going out and trying new things and being open-minded because one, that’s again how you build relationships with them. Two, it’s also how you have a lot more fun in your career. And those are the memories that you hold onto for rest of your life. You mentioned something really interesting too that I always like to talk about, which is kind of the Instagram and TikTok craziness. Like you’ll see all these crazy exercises and everything.
Jess Givens:
yeah.
Connor Agnew:
You know, how does that philosophy of staying open-minded apply to that specific scenario for you? Where an athlete may come in and say, Hey, can we do this 45 degree trap bar band resistant, know, whatever it may be crazy deal.
Jess Givens:
Yeah. I’ve actually had a couple of athletes do that to me. was a of basketball players at St. Mary’s and they’re like, oh, the guys for hoops are doing this type of thing. they show me the video and I look through it. And then the first thing I do after I watch the video is I look at the profile because sometimes I want to figure out why exactly are they doing this? Is it an actual basketball player showing you the workout? Are they professional level? Are they across seas? And some of the stuff I do see like, yeah, we’ll do it maybe eventually, just not at that time. Because some of the stuff I learned
The baseline of my basketball stuff I learned was at Madison with Jim Snyder, great resource, by the way. And I would have to have that conversation, especially with some stuff is a lot of the stuff they see nowadays, especially when it comes to freshmen, they see a lot of the bodybuilder stuff. like a lot of like the drop sets till failures and you see the people that are recording themselves. Like you’re still growing at that age. You’re still maturing. You’re not fully developed. So they have that ability to do that. But my question is, is this person you’re looking at playing the same sport as you, are they the same body type?
And depending on what the exercise or movement is, we might be doing it already in the future or like, yeah, we can give it a try. I’ll sometimes ask the athlete, hey, I want you to try this and then tell me how you feel. Because if they like it and I try and I like it and agree, sure be it. But also mind you, I do not have TikTok. I just have the Instagram Reels. they show me a lot of crazy stuff on TikTok. And I’m like, there’s only so much I can do.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah, I unfortunately
not only have a tech talk, I post on it frequently as well too. So I’m very tapped into what these people see. ⁓ But I think you bring up a great point and know, part of one of the best tools I’ve ever had is just saying, hey, we might not be doing this right now. Maybe we’ll do it in the future, right? And kind of tabling it. And then that way it also, I feel like the issue that becomes, you know, why I like you saying the open-minded piece so much is…
when somebody, an athlete brings something to you, right? And it’s a video that is ridiculous. And you know for a fact, you may never do it and you shut it down completely and you just completely rip it apart.
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm.
Connor Agnew:
It also shuts that athlete down and it shows them like, hey, I’m not willing to have a conversation about these things. And they may have brought it just because they thought it was something that was cool and they wanted just to show you something. said, you know what? ⁓ coach Jess would really like this. I wanted to show her this. Right. And if you come in and you say, no, this is stupid. We’d never do anything like this. I can’t believe they would do it. You know, it really shuts down the idea, but it also shuts the athlete down. So I appreciate very greatly. You’re being open minded. ⁓ I think it makes a big difference. Seriously.
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm.
Connor Agnew:
And you bring up Jim Snyder too. I had the chance to meet Jim Snyder when Wisconsin whooped us last year at basketball. So I’m Jim, I’m a Jim Snyder fan unless we play them. So.
Jess Givens:
He’s a great individual and he’s good friends with Carmen Pata. So that was another good connection coming from River Falls to Madison. So I had someone I already knew there, but also I kind of felt more comfortable. Like he had very similar training concepts with Pata that I’ve seen. So having those conversations was amazing and I’ve never felt more sure in my life working with that basketball team, but I’m okay with it.
Connor Agnew:
Mm-hmm.
Yeah,
absolutely, absolutely. Man, well, yeah, he did a great job with the guys. I mean, they dominated us, so that was awesome. You know, you mentioned one thing when you first started talking about your career and your journey and that, you know, there’s times where you kind of experience burnout or you felt a little bit like being overwhelmed from work. And I think a lot of strength coaches can relate to that. You know, can you tell me about that experience and what you did to basically address the issue you were saying?
Jess Givens:
Yeah.
Absolutely. ⁓ So when it comes to burnout, yeah, also from perspective, it’s not always going to be work related. It’s going to be a combination of everything in life. There’s the reason why there’s a work balance when it comes to our career. And we’re not the average, you know, nine to five, 40 hours a week job. We’re the early mornings with maybe some breaks in between to late evenings, or maybe you have that coach that’s just back to back sessions throughout the day. I believe
There’s times where I have just come home and I just might have just completely shut my body and mind down for like maybe half an hour just without realizing like, hey, I drilled myself today. Maybe not physically, but mentally because there’s just so much going on. And there’s times where I might get overwhelmed of like, okay, I have this to do, I have this to do, I have this to do, or I’m worried about something else that might be happening in two weeks. And all of this kind of just bundles up together. And I think the big part of it is that we, myself personally, I’m someone that keeps things inside and I’ve just always been like that.
I’m an only child. I’ve been raised by two amazing parents that like I’m grateful they’re my biggest support system and I can always call them and talk to them about this type of thing. Mind you, they had no idea what my job was for about a year and a half. They never understood it all. So when I just gave it to them, it was kind of just almost like an open rant and they’re just like, yeah, I’m here listening. kudos to them handling that. I love that. But it’s just, I think not realizing like you gotta take it day by day.
And when I did experience burnout, was kind of just the oversight of there’s point of views from coaches of what they want to do. This is what I want to do with athletes. There’s this going on my schedule. ⁓ A coach and I might not be on the same page as something or an athlete’s being a pain in the butt once in a while. There’s just all these variables. I can just congregate together. And one of the biggest things I did, and it was at St. Mary’s at the time, because I think I was about a year and a couple months in, and it was when I was realizing like, you
Working a part-time job to help pay for things. I’m not getting paid the most for it for five teams. Working day in and day out. I am doing extra work on the side, not just at the university, but I was a waitress at a time just to get some more money in. So that worry just kind of got all bundled up. And one day I’m like, I need to go talk to somebody. And I ended up going talking to a therapist about once a week to help let all out. But it was also nice just to have someone there I can talk to and not be judgmental at all or.
They’re just there as a big support system. wasn’t someone who never knew anything about me, about my life, just someone who would sit there and listen. And that’s, think, a really big, especially in our field where we’re surrounded by athletes, we’re about coworkers, and we’re all very similar to what we do. We kind of just want someone who wants nothing to do with what you do, with your work, your life, nada. Because then when they come with a response back to you, it’s very genuine. It’s very helpful. It’s mutual. They’re there for you.
going to talk to her was a big relief off my chest knowing she’s right. Like I shouldn’t be having to worry about this. I shouldn’t have to stress about this. Like it’s out of my control. And I think just hearing it from somebody I had no idea who was or related to me made me really take it in a lot more. So having that support system, yes, I love my parents. I love my mentor, Pata. I’ve talked to him every so often about stuff like this, but just someone random that I can.
talked to about something really helped get things off my chest and depress. It was fantastic. Another thing I’ve done is I’ve literally just driven out of town to the middle of nowhere and just let everything out. Like meant just I’ve driven to a different neighbor town I’ve never been before and I just kind of sit in my car and just ignore everything about my life mentally, work, you name it and I just let it all go. And I think that kind of helps put like a big reset in my mind mentally of like, this is where I am now. I’m in the present moment.
And I kind of went back and forth to a book, ⁓ Mind You for the Language, which is called Unfuck Yourself by Kerry John Bishop. But it was a very great book to read at the time when I was starting to get the burnout feelings because it talked about being in the present moment, controlling your controllables. Don’t let your emotions take over. And kind of going back to some of those things really kind of put me back to my center self of it’s OK. You have tomorrow. But you don’t worry about tomorrow. You worry about today. If today was your last day on Earth,
Connor Agnew:
Thank
Jess Givens:
Did you spend it well? Did you make the impact on athletes? Did you do what you needed to do today? And that really also helped put less worry of the future and focus on me right now. Because at end of the day, if I’m healthy and I’m happy, then I should be happy no matter what happened today. Even if a weight room session was misscheduled or poor communication between a coach. At the end of the day, am I happy? Am I healthy as things went the way it need to be today? Is it a tomorrow problem? Sure. Push it aside. Focus on today, though.
Connor Agnew:
That’s awesome. Well, thank you so much. Seriously, no, seriously, I really appreciate you being so open about everything because this is a big problem within the field. And if you see within straight conditioning, like I think of my best friends who I came up with and I was interns with and GAs with or young strength coaches and people I reached out to, so many of them have left the field ⁓ and they just understand that they can’t do it anymore. And so I really appreciate you being able to one, talk about it, then two,
Jess Givens:
You
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Connor Agnew:
about your solutions about what you’ve done for it. And I really appreciate you bringing up going to see a therapist as well too, because I think it’s one of the best tools that you can possibly have. And I agree with you wholeheartedly on just the completely objective view that somebody can give you. Because I think even with my wife and I, right, we’ve both seen therapists, right, we’ve both spoken ⁓ opposite. We both speak to each other, right, about all these things that go on. It’s my best friend. I’ve communicated every single thing to her, no problem.
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Connor Agnew:
But obviously when she tells me about her problems, I’m still gonna have it in the lens of okay Somebody’s talking to my wife about this way or she needs to handle it this way So there’s a little bit of bias there and then I think too, you know when she goes and sees a therapist when I go and see a therapist we can talk about things a hundred percent open and honestly as well and you don’t have to worry about hurting the other person’s feelings like you saying with like you said with your parents like these are people
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm.
Connor Agnew:
who have a lot of background. They know Jess for your entire life, right? And they raised you. So there’s a lot of background there and they’re always gonna see you as their daughter. So ultimately there’s a lot of history there. So when you can go see somebody who’s completely objective, has no clue about anything else that’s going on besides just what you tell them, it really, makes things a lot more clear and it makes it a lot more easily understood, especially when you get that feedback immediately back. And then one thing that I had to learn too was when I first started out,
Jess Givens:
Yeah.
Connor Agnew:
I’ve kind of probably by the same time frame in my career started feeling the same, you know, issues of burnout and feel like maybe this career isn’t for me. I would go see a therapist and she was like, you understand, like, this is crazy, right? Like the career that you’re doing is crazy. Like the amount of hours you work and the pay and everything. And it was for me was finding out, OK, this is crazy, but it is something that I want to do and like accepting that and understanding that. So I would never have been able to get that perspective because everybody else I know is in the athletics world. And so they’re all just going to say, well, you know,
Jess Givens:
yeah.
Connor Agnew:
It is what it is, you know, or another day, another dollar, like whatever the sayings may be amongst other strength coaches. When, you know, I’ve ultimately went to somebody who was completely outside of it was like, this is crazy. Like if you love doing it, then you should keep doing it. But you gotta understand that this is a, this is a weird career. This is not what people typically do. And so for me to have that experience was really, really beneficial. So I appreciate you sharing your experience because a lot of coaches struggle with it. A lot of coaches don’t like talking about it. And I think it can be very detrimental to the career.
Jess Givens:
I think it needs to be something that we’ve spoken up more often, honestly. It’s kind of like shadowed to the point of like, if you love what you do, money’s not a factor, the long hours are not a factor. They tell you all these things of why you love what you do. And it’s like, yeah, I love maybe some early mornings and late evenings. I love being able to help athletes. But then at the day, you are still a human being and you have to take care of yourself. having that resource, we have a team psychiatrist here, which I think is fantastic for our athletes to have. So I’m going to talk to you on their own behalf.
But even ourselves, like even at a young age, we should not have to fear of, oh my gosh, what happens if I don’t want to in this career anymore because of all these things. We gotta be okay to like, hey, just take a step back or talk to someone about it. It’s okay to not be perfect all the time. We have feelings, we have our mental status. We need to be able to take care of ourselves first. Because if we are not healthy, we’re not being able to be 110 % coaching for athletes. So we have to ourselves first sometimes. And accepting that, like, hey, burnout.
can happen, but knowing how to take those precautions, whether you want to stay in the field and you want to take care of it, or maybe you need a break. know, there’s maybe people out there that take maybe a year or two off from their field because they have to just recollect themselves before they get in, or a new change of environment or job. There’s all these options, but taking care of our bodies and ourselves are number one when it comes to our field as well.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah, yeah, and you bring up such a good point too with, you you can almost feel pigeonholed in this career sometimes, you know, where it’s like, okay, this is, you know, training conditioning is so unique. This is probably one the only things I can do. So now as a young strength coach, I’m super terrified about, okay, I can only be a strength coach for the rest of my life when there are a lot of other options, right? And there are different things you can do with your degree or, you know, even just something completely outside of what we’ve based our education in. But ⁓ there’s a lot of pressure on young strength coaches. And then, like you said, too, to be perfect.
⁓ Part of internships is just constantly being told what you’re doing is wrong and correcting it, right? And then finding out, okay, well, you didn’t correct it good enough, so we’re have to keep correcting it, whatever it may be. ⁓ Even if it’s from a really nice mentor who can really help you out, you’re still being told what you’re doing is wrong a lot of the time. So ⁓ there’s a lot of a perfectionist kind of mentality within the career too. So I really appreciate you bringing it up because it’s stressful. It’s a super stressful career.
Jess Givens:
Yeah.
Connor Agnew:
And there’s a lot of benefits to it. Like you said, there’s a family atmosphere. There’s a lot of fun that you can have. ⁓ But ultimately, like you have to be able to know if you can balance those or not. And then maybe it is time to take a break, which is OK, too. And it’s like it’s not the worst thing in the world to take a break. feel like a lot of times with training conditioning, people can kind of say you take a break. Well, then you’re cooked for the rest of your career. You’re never going be able to get anything. It’s like it’s just not true. Like there’s time for all of those things.
Jess Givens:
Absolutely, like we need to put ourselves first sometimes and you know, we always put the athletes first. The reason why we love the SEAL, we want to the athletes approve or achieve their goals in the future. We want to be able to communicate, make those relationships, but at the end of the day, if we’re not happy and taking care of our bodies, we’re knocking years off our lives early to too early. It’s the reason why we probably say early mornings, late nights, we some of us have a caffeine addiction to function throughout the day. You never know. We’re human just as them.
We don’t practice like we preach it like hey, when you get sleep, we should do good sleep. They should eat well, we should eat well. But we should also take care of their bodies and minds, so shall we.
Connor Agnew:
No, it’s only fair, seriously. And we preach all this stuff because it works right for a reason. There’s a reason why, you know, not overdose on caffeine every day and getting to sleep and eating complete plates makes a difference. So I agree. You know, I might take your ⁓ piece of the second piece of advice you have. So you might find me in Wilkesboro, North Carolina later today, just a completely random town and just letting everything go.
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm.
Connor Agnew:
⁓ So I think that helps too, honestly, because like you said, you get to just stay in the present moment and you just get to ⁓ be there for yourself. That’s another way of putting yourself first. So I love that too.
Jess Givens:
Mm-hmm.
Absolutely, just for 4th of July, I didn’t have any plans so my friend Kenzie and I, we ended up just going to Fargo, which is an hour and a half away, but it was enough away where we didn’t worry about anything. We just enjoyed our time together, talked shop, whatever we want, and it just felt nice to not worry about anything else. We were there for ourselves. Nobody else, nothing else. Yeah.
Connor Agnew:
Yep.
That’s awesome. And it’s just,
like you said, it’s just more fun and allows you to enjoy the times with your athletes just a little bit more. Okay, so the final question I have for you is I got to see on your Instagram as well too, you’re big into meal prepping. What is your favorite meal prep to prepare?
Jess Givens:
You
crappy Instagram that I don’t really post much on anymore. Mind you, I have that coaching one just so athletes can follow, because I do keep my personal one. Another reason why for the professional personalism. Yep. So my biggest one was over the summer a lot. It was overnight oats just because it was carbs and protein, but it was also cold. And so when I was at St. Mary’s, we were outside a lot for our camps. So it was always hot. It was just quick and easy to make. But I think my favorite meal I ever made myself was it’s called
Connor Agnew:
Yep, fair enough.
Jess Givens:
The given’s special, but it’s beef sausage, rice, red and black beans. It’s like in a box mix. But I can just cook that whenever throughout the year and I can just big fat carb protein load and just feels so homey to me. So like I can make those can last all week, but I know like a football player can probably eat in a day, but it serves like a good amount of people. And that’s just like my favorite thing to make, especially when it’s like a late day, like I to come home, eat food, takes maybe half an hour to make. Cook the sausage, rice and beans.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah.
Jess Givens:
And I’m good. It just makes me feel more at home. So it’s also another reset to myself of like, if I need to get myself grounded, make a home meal, whether it’s the red beans and rice given special. I’ve done twice baked spaghetti. That was a big one when I worked with some wrestlers. Like they loved it. But no, I love to cook. I love to cook. That’s like a therapy thing to me of I’ll meal prep every week. If I need to make something new. I know over the summer I made a peanut butter cake and I brought that a couple of times here and they ate that up. I’m like, I just want to try something new. I didn’t eat it. They all did.
Connor Agnew:
That’s awesome.
Jess Givens:
all mattered.
Connor Agnew:
So you share food with your athletes as well.
That’s awesome. I’m sure they love that, especially when you’re bringing in peanut butter cake.
Jess Givens:
yeah, I made protein balls one day and asked how, can you try this? Tell me how you like it. I tell them love to cook. Hey, can you make a peanut butter cake? Sure, I’ll try. Makes two, brings them in. Our athletic trainers were eating some of it. As long as they’re happy and they’re showing that I can be human too, like hey, try it.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah, I do
stuff outside of strength and conditioning too. I have hobbies as well. ⁓ That’s what my wife makes sourdough all the time, which is like the best possible hobby for a significant other. I mean, cause like literally I have at home right now, full loaf of cheddar and chive sourdough waiting for me. So I’m going to crush that when I get home for sure.
Jess Givens:
the
Tutter and
chive sourdough. ⁓
Connor Agnew:
Cheddar
chives so good. did, what was it, rosemary and white cheddar the other, it’s endless. Sausage bread, it’s like the best thing ever. So we did focaccia too, which was absolutely incredible, which is basically just deep fried bread. I’m not.
Jess Givens:
There’s
a Wisconsin thing, I think it’s called Spicy Cheese Bread. It’s a Wisconsin thing at the Farmers Market. It’s just this one bakery makes it and it’s cheese with red flake pepper in it and it’s bread that make buns of it. You can only get it at this one bakery but it was to die for when I first tried it and I’m like, I would never imagine pepper and cheese in a bread, never. But it was delicious.
Connor Agnew:
Mm.
Yeah, it’s incredible.
it’s just next level. It’s like literally just like ⁓ a very ⁓ pizza form of bread, which is awesome. Well,
Jess Givens:
Absolutely, absolutely. So if you’re gonna make that with
the pizza, it’s just next level game right there.
Connor Agnew:
Yeah,
yeah, absolutely. Well, I’m going to have to make myself a given special as well for my meal prep next week. I’ll do it in honor of you too. And here we go. Please do. Seriously, I’d love it. So, well, thank you so much for coming on, Jess. I really appreciate it. Just to get to know you better. And I really, really appreciate what you shared with everybody. I think this is a really impactful episode, which are my favorite ones to do. So I really appreciate you. If somebody wants to follow your Instagram or wants to keep up with you, what would be the best way to do that?
Jess Givens:
⁓ I’ll send you the recipe. I’ll send you the recipe.
Yeah, my Instagram is coach underscore Givens Jess, I believe. I’ll give you the notes for that. I use it more of just to keep track with other coaches at that point, but that would be the best way to reach out to me. ⁓ They could also go through my email, which is on our StackDeferee. It’s just could dot Givens at you and D dot edu. ⁓ I got my phone, my work phone on me. So I’ll always be checking emails and DMs through my Instagram because I love to answer questions, especially when it comes to young coaches. We’re all in this together. So don’t be shy. Absolutely. And it was an honor to be here.
Connor Agnew:
You’re good.
Jess Givens:
This being my first podcast was meaningful to me knowing I can actually talk about all this and I really love to
Connor Agnew:
Well, it’s an honor for me to have you on seriously. I would never be able to tell it was your first podcast. You absolutely crushed it. I appreciate you. Thank you.
Jess Givens:
I appreciate so much.
Thank you.
